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post #76 of (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Dru

Oh well, if the dog runs away again they can always get a monkey. Take him to Ikea and stuff, no search needed there.
Well, he would be wearing a diaper and a shearling coat at least.
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post #77 of (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 10:32 PM
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post #78 of (permalink) Old 12-13-2012, 07:59 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by nwaber
My point in a nutshell: everything depends on the owners getting their act together. Hopefully the hard lesson that takes effect is theirs.
This case might not be that simple. The dog was out with a friend of the family and their dog; Ohly ran away trying to look for his owners.

So the owners need to stress to others looking after their dog; to keep him leashed or he will run away and not come back. Of course this also depends on someone else other than the owners (or the dog) to follow instructions.
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post #79 of (permalink) Old 12-13-2012, 11:02 AM Thread Starter
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Just saw these two blog posting while reading other blogs on the site. Helps to explain the why rescue, etc.

http://blog.oplopanax.ca/2012/12/why...arch-for-dogs/

http://blog.oplopanax.ca/2011/04/on-rescuing-animals/
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post #80 of (permalink) Old 12-13-2012, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by joker

Just saw these two blog posting while reading other blogs on the site. Helps to explain the why rescue, etc.

http://blog.oplopanax.ca/2012/12/why...arch-for-dogs/

http://blog.oplopanax.ca/2011/04/on-rescuing-animals/
I forgot I wrote that article twice.

I agree with some posters here that resources spent searching for a dog could create a condition where a search for a person will be under-resourced due to exhausted SAR members, or resources that are committed to the field and can't easily be retrieved for a second rescue.

This clearly wasn't the case for this rescue, since the helicopter team was staged and ready, so the reverse was true; the response to Cypress was faster.

However, North Shore Rescue is by far the busiest SAR team in BC. A condition where all of their members are exhausted can easily happen. On some weekends they pull off five separate rescues!

We have to trust to the discretion of the SAR managers on this one. NSR, like all SAR teams, regularly exercise the option to call other teams in to assist. If their members were tired from one search, they would have called adjoining SAR teams to assist rather than place their members in harms way by sending them into a second search in a compromised state. This involves a slower response time, which would be factored in. This is why NSR probably had members in reserve for a second search while looking for the dog.

Teams regularly put adjoining teams on stand by to alert them of a possible call, sometimes hours in advance.

My team has rescued about 6 dogs in the last 12 years, to much less fanfare and media attention. Most of the time the dog is with the subject of the search. Only once did we search for a dog, but we never found it. On one memorable search, we carried a very large (120 pound), and irritable dog on a stretcher for about 6 hours.
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post #81 of (permalink) Old 12-13-2012, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Kid Charlemagne

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Kootenay Kid
...
The second point of clarification is an easy misconception. While SAR volunteers are covered for "workplace injuries" it technically isn't through WCB. There are no premiums paid but WCB protocols and criteria are used to determine any benefits that need to be paid.
That's not correct.

http://embc.gov.bc.ca/em/policy/5.12-_WCB_Coverage.pdf
Kootenay Kid is correct.

The policy bulletin only outlines how and under what conditions the coverage is activated.
The mechanics of how the coverage is delivered is opaque. My understanding is that the funds come directly from Government of BC and are merely administered through WSBC.

Being a SAR volunteer puts you in a strange area; you're a "worker" at a "work site" so WSBC can do an investigations as in the Sweatman incident. Who are you working for? If the RCMP call you, they are your boss so technically you should be under federal rules.

But we're not, EMBC sets the rules, and provides the coverage.
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post #82 of (permalink) Old 12-13-2012, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by oplopanax

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Kid Charlemagne

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Kootenay Kid
...
The second point of clarification is an easy misconception. While SAR volunteers are covered for "workplace injuries" it technically isn't through WCB. There are no premiums paid but WCB protocols and criteria are used to determine any benefits that need to be paid.
That's not correct.

http://embc.gov.bc.ca/em/policy/5.12-_WCB_Coverage.pdf
Kootenay Kid is correct.

The policy bulletin only outlines how and under what conditions the coverage is activated.
The mechanics of how the coverage is delivered is opaque. My understanding is that the funds come directly from Government of BC and are merely administered through WSBC.

Being a SAR volunteer puts you in a strange area; you're a "worker" at a "work site" so WSBC can do an investigations as in the Sweatman incident. Who are you working for? If the RCMP call you, they are your boss so technically you should be under federal rules.

But we're not, EMBC sets the rules, and provides the coverage.
Sorry, I seem to have started some unnecessary hair splitting, my apologies. As it is, WSBC provides and administers the coverage to SAR volunteers. The delivery and source of funds for the coverage is better illustrated in the following link, in particular on page 1 and page 7.

http://embc.gov.bc.ca/em/volunteer/E..._Liability.pdf
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post #83 of (permalink) Old 12-13-2012, 10:49 PM
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Kid Charlemagne

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by oplopanax

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Kid Charlemagne

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Kootenay Kid
...
The second point of clarification is an easy misconception. While SAR volunteers are covered for "workplace injuries" it technically isn't through WCB. There are no premiums paid but WCB protocols and criteria are used to determine any benefits that need to be paid.
That's not correct.

http://embc.gov.bc.ca/em/policy/5.12-_WCB_Coverage.pdf
Kootenay Kid is correct.

The policy bulletin only outlines how and under what conditions the coverage is activated.
The mechanics of how the coverage is delivered is opaque. My understanding is that the funds come directly from Government of BC and are merely administered through WSBC.

Being a SAR volunteer puts you in a strange area; you're a "worker" at a "work site" so WSBC can do an investigations as in the Sweatman incident. Who are you working for? If the RCMP call you, they are your boss so technically you should be under federal rules.

But we're not, EMBC sets the rules, and provides the coverage.
Sorry, I seem to have started some unnecessary hair splitting, my apologies. As it is, WSBC provides and administers the coverage to SAR volunteers. The delivery and source of funds for the coverage is better illustrated in the following link, in particular on page 1 and page 7.

http://embc.gov.bc.ca/em/volunteer/E..._Liability.pdf
FWIW, I am interested in this topic so I don't mind the splitting of hairs. I wish someone had a diagram that explained exactly how SAR is funded and regulated in Canada and what the differences are between land operations, marine operations and searching for downed aircraft.
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post #84 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2012, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Steventy
.....
Sorry, I seem to have started some unnecessary hair splitting, my apologies. As it is, WSBC provides and administers the coverage to SAR volunteers. The delivery and source of funds for the coverage is better illustrated in the following link, in particular on page 1 and page 7.

http://embc.gov.bc.ca/em/volunteer/E..._Liability.pdf
FWIW, I am interested in this topic so I don't mind the splitting of hairs. I wish someone had a diagram that explained exactly how SAR is funded and regulated in Canada and what the differences are between land operations, marine operations and searching for downed aircraft.
[/quote]

Yes, hair splitting indeed; WSBC administers the coverage, the federal government "provides" (pays) 75%, the BC government "provides" (pays) 25%.

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Steventy
.....
Sorry, I seem to have started some unnecessary hair splitting, my apologies. As it is, WSBC provides and administers the coverage to SAR volunteers. The delivery and source of funds for the coverage is better illustrated in the following link, in particular on page 1 and page 7.

http://embc.gov.bc.ca/em/volunteer/E..._Liability.pdf
FWIW, I am interested in this topic so I don't mind the splitting of hairs. I wish someone had a diagram that explained exactly how SAR is funded and regulated in Canada and what the differences are between land operations, marine operations and searching for downed aircraft.
[/quote]

Yes, hair splitting indeed; WSBC administers the coverage, the federal government "provides" (pays) 75%, the BC government "provides" (pays) 25%.

Steventy, I could talk for several hours on the SAR delivery model in Canada and BC, but it's sufficient to say that there is no consistency in funding, standards, or provision. Not even within the Province of BC, which does more than half of the ground SAR and very large proportion of Marine and Air SAR in Canada.

This is a know issue, and BCSARA took on a year long project to try to figure out how SAR is delivered in BC. I have not read the report yet.

Very recently there were some meetings to begin setting ground SAR standards through SARVAC
http://www.csa.ca/cm/ca/en/news/arti...race-standards

It would be nice if there were some body which would take on the analysis of incidents and redistribute resources where they are needed most, rather than the haphazard method we are using now.
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post #85 of (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Dru

Oh well, if the dog runs away again they can always get a monkey. Take him to Ikea and stuff, no search needed there.
I need sar to find my way out of ikea
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