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post #31 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 02:12 AM
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By and large BC's wildlife regulations and enforcement are pretty good. The vast majority of legit hunters also keep an eye out for offenders and have the RAPP line to call in poachers, polluters and dick heads. I think we need more conservation officers but on the whole hunting in BC is well regulated. There's been some excellent wildlife management progress.


Decades ago, many of BC's 56 Grizzly bear population units were classified as 'threatened'. Today that number is down to just 9 which are classified as threatened. I'd venture to say that, no matter the public sentiment, most of the recently banned grizzly trophy hunt is indeed sustainable and well within the capacity of the Grizzly population to handle the hunt. That said, I totally agree with Premier Horgan's decision to ban the trophy hunt and i think most BC'ers, including food game hunters, find the killing of an apex predator to put its head on the wall as untenable. Yes, it's sustainable and maybe opposition is indeed not evidence-based. I just think it's awful to do that.

As a caveat to that, some of the larger Grizzly hunting outfits are run by first nations enterprises and they are exempt from the ban. So let none of us think that Grizzly trophy hunting in BC is gone completely.
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post #32 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 01:42 PM
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...some of the larger Grizzly hunting outfits are run by first nations enterprises and they are exempt from the ban.
I didn't realize that guiding trophy-hunts was a part of their "heritage"...
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post #33 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 07:36 PM
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I didn't realize that guiding trophy-hunts was a part of their "heritage"...
Neither did I, but we're all in for a surprise when the grizzly heads get stuffed into the bags of german hunters later this year.

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post #34 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 08:13 PM
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You know what they say..."Money talks and BS walks..."

As I see it, if Trophy hunting is banned, it should be banned to ALL...........guided trophy-hunts are not for sustenance or ceremonial purposes (unless of course the ceremony is the worship of money) so it shouldn't be allowed.
Sad part is that there isn't a politician alive with the backbone to even suggest this; Political suicide via social-media crucifixion.
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post #35 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 11:18 PM
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My 2 cents:
Hunting within legal limits for food : Unless you live in isolation, it is never actually necessary no matter what proponents say. You can almost always buy farmed meat. It is also completely unsustainable and impractical to feed any significant portion of population, that is why people have farms. Population of the planet is way past what can be sustained by all-natural methods and I don't see how anybody deserves special things, but since it is legal and limited to some reasonable quota, I don't see it being any more harmful than any other motorized sport if done responsibly.
Trophy hunting, it irks me the wrong way on many levels.
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post #36 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 11:40 PM
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I think hunting for food is good as long it's done sustainably and properly; while definitely not a necessity in almost any situation, it usually doesn't have a huge population effect on deer, elk, moose, fish, etc.

I would be careful saying "hormone-filled chickens", "laced with hormones", etc. as this is false and misleading. There's more estrogens in a handful of soybeans than there is in a lb of beef and there's exponentially more estrogenic compounds in birth control pills. Commercial poultry is not raised with the use of hormones; it does not add to their production.

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post #37 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 11:53 PM
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I would be careful saying "hormone-filled chickens", "laced with hormones", etc. as this is false and misleading. There's more estrogens in a handful of soybeans than there is in a lb of beef and there's exponentially more estrogenic compounds in birth control pills. Commercial poultry is not raised with the use of hormones; it does not add to their production.
Okay then, how about "I can't stand to eat animals that can't stand on their own feet because they are jammed into small cages? I wonder how many anti-hunters have actually seen commercial food mills....or visited a killing floor.
Those strange white "dog houses" that you see by the dairy farms....do they know what those are for?

Hunting is humane, by comparison...one bullet, no stress, over-in-an-instant.
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post #38 of (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 11:53 PM
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My 2 cents:
Hunting within legal limits for food : Unless you live in isolation, it is never actually necessary no matter what proponents say. You can almost always buy farmed meat. It is also completely unsustainable and impractical to feed any significant portion of population, that is why people have farms. Population of the planet is way past what can be sustained by all-natural methods and I don't see how anybody deserves special things, but since it is legal and limited to some reasonable quota, I don't see it being any more harmful than any other motorized sport if done responsibly.
Trophy hunting, it irks me the wrong way on many levels.
I agree with this 10000%. Specially with "Population of the planet is way past what can be sustained by all-natural methods"

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I would be careful saying "hormone-filled chickens", "laced with hormones", etc. as this is false and misleading. There's more estrogens in a handful of soybeans than there is in a lb of beef and there's exponentially more estrogenic compounds in birth control pills. Commercial poultry is not raised with the use of hormones; it does not add to their production.
In theory, yes. Practically -- I am not so sure. Remember these awful scenes with chicken raping somewhere on farm in Chilliwack last year? It went around the nation. Who knows what else is going on these places. I worked in Timmie nights while putting myself through college & witnessed certain things in the kitchen that you would not believe. Remember when they found human thumb in hamburger at Jack in the Box down in the States? Or these recalls that are now regular in mass grocery markets? Point is, to stress again what Toaster said, there is just so many people & this requires mass food production. Whenever there is something on large scale, all kinds of things happen.

But, this still does not justify "let's just go and hunt for food by ourselves". Unless absolute necessity in remote areas of course.
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post #39 of (permalink) Old 01-11-2018, 12:36 AM
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Okay then, how about "I can't stand to eat animals that can't stand on their own feet because they are jammed into small cages? I wonder how many anti-hunters have actually seen commercial food mills....or visited a killing floor.
Those strange white "dog houses" that you see by the dairy farms....do they know what those are for?

Hunting is humane, by comparison...one bullet, no stress, over-in-an-instant.
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I agree with this 10000%. Specially with "Population of the planet is way past what can be sustained by all-natural methods.

In theory, yes. Practically -- I am not so sure. Remember these awful scenes with chicken raping somewhere on farm in Chilliwack last year? It went around the nation. Who knows what else is going on these places. I worked in Timmie nights while putting myself through college & witnessed certain things in the kitchen that you would not believe. Remember when they found human thumb in hamburger at Jack in the Box down in the States? Or these recalls that are now regular in mass grocery markets? Point is, to stress again what Toaster said, there is just so many people & this requires mass food production. Whenever there is something on large scale, all kinds of things happen.

But, this still does not justify "let's just go and hunt for food by ourselves". Unless absolute necessity in remote areas of course.

For sure, there's definite need for constant improvement for animal welfare when it comes to farming. I can respect someone's personal choice to hunt instead or not buy meat from the store if they choose based on that.

I think hunting is great, but there can also be humane issues when not done properly. I guess it just comes down to people being educated properly and honing their technique.

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post #40 of (permalink) Old 01-11-2018, 09:39 AM
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But, this still does not justify "let's just go and hunt for food by ourselves". Unless absolute necessity in remote areas of course.
Hunters do not need to "justify" their pastime. Hunting is legal, sustainable and a better option for those who care about what they consume. In fact, I'll go as far as to say that by and large, hunters are the MOST ethical meat eaters on the planet.
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post #41 of (permalink) Old 01-11-2018, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by treord8 View Post
I think hunting for food is good as long it's done sustainably and properly; while definitely not a necessity in almost any situation, it usually doesn't have a huge population effect on deer, elk, moose, fish, etc.

I would be careful saying "hormone-filled chickens", "laced with hormones", etc. as this is false and misleading. There's more estrogens in a handful of soybeans than there is in a lb of beef and there's exponentially more estrogenic compounds in birth control pills. Commercial poultry is not raised with the use of hormones; it does not add to their production.
I am under the impression that all chickens raised or sold in Canada are hormone free, by law. If you see a chicken labeled "hormone free", it's just a marketing ploy... Same as if you sold apples labeled "fish free". While it may be true, it's redundant.
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post #42 of (permalink) Old 01-11-2018, 08:23 PM
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Our lives are replete with things that allow us to live in huge numbers on this planet, particularly in cities. Modern public water and sewer systems, with treatment, are probably the greatest contributors to human health ever devised. Second to that would be modern agriculture, vegetable and animal, that today provides more food than the human race can even consume. That, of course, is notwithstanding irregularities in distribution and political monsters who create gross inequity, starvation and destitution.

So no, nobody 'needs' to hunt, but in rural communities around BC, it provides meaningful, significant sustenance to many thousands of people in a well managed format. God speed, I say.

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post #43 of (permalink) Old 01-11-2018, 09:16 PM
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I'm done...
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Last edited by TheShadow; 01-11-2018 at 11:24 PM.
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post #44 of (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 12:44 AM
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I'm done...
.. and you'll be back for hockey (or another hunting topic). How about real trip report some time? You've been on CT forever and you are a good member. Why not contribute a bit more? Seriously


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Originally Posted by xj6response View Post
Our lives are replete with things that allow us to live in huge numbers on this planet, particularly in cities. Modern public water and sewer systems, with treatment, are probably the greatest contributors to human health ever devised. Second to that would be modern agriculture, vegetable and animal, that today provides more food than the human race can even consume. That, of course, is notwithstanding irregularities in distribution and political monsters who create gross inequity, starvation and destitution.

So no, nobody 'needs' to hunt, but in rural communities around BC, it provides meaningful, significant sustenance to many thousands of people in a well managed format. God speed, I say.
I agree with this. Specially the part about modern era food production. We just have it too good. We need gyms or even worse surgical procedures because we are overweight from eating too much food. We need escalators because heaven forbid to walk flight of stairs. And my ultimate pet-peeve: junk food drive-ins. So you don't even have to make 5 steps from the car instead keep sitting and open the mouth so french fries and burgers can hop in.

I'm done too
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post #45 of (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 01:16 AM
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