First Multi Day Pack (70-80L) need advice! - Page 2 - ClubTread Community

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post #16 of (permalink) Old 03-31-2015, 02:12 PM
Dru
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65L bag is way too small for 5-8 days. I'd look for 90L+. Once you throw in the sleeping bag and a tent inside, the space disappears real fast... unless of course you want these items hanging from outside, which will make for a less comfortable bag.
Maybe your problem is that you have cheap, bulky crap. Plenty of people can do long trips with light gear and a small pack. A good lightweight summer bag can pack down to 1L volume or less.
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post #17 of (permalink) Old 03-31-2015, 05:25 PM
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My son and I did the WCT in 6 days (5 nights) with an Ibex 80 and an Alpine Lowe 65, and we were packed to the gills..

But we had synthetic sleeping bags, an MEC two-man tent with fly, plenty of food, compressible pillows, sleeping pads, camera, bear spray..

I wish I'd learned about UL before I'd started shopping.. I'll never be a gram weenie, and I use everything I bring (well, not the bear spray, knock on wood!), but I definitely could have made better choices with the big 4 (pack, tent, sleeping bag, cooking/eating kit).

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post #18 of (permalink) Old 03-31-2015, 07:23 PM
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I've done 5 nights with my Gregory Palisade 77l without any issues, and still had plenty of room. The only time I've had to put anything on the outside is when I travel with both of my kids.
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post #19 of (permalink) Old 03-31-2015, 07:39 PM
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I would first check your scale to be accurate, because all of the above, including the pack, will not be at 16.5 lbs. And is it a tent or a tent fly? You need to be more honest about what's in your pack, because a tent fly is not a tent, while you listed a tent being packed.
Yes Arnold, I have checked my scale. In fact, I tested it with a pile of loonies and I got the exact weight that I should. Loonie weights I looked up at the Royal Canadian Mint website. Happy now?

Yes Arnold, I carry a complete tent, including a footprint and stakes. Just because the fly alone resides in the front pocket of my pack doesn't mean I lied about carrying the rest of the tent. Did I really have to explain that?

Regarding food weight, you might want to look into getting yourself a dehydrator.

Go over to the backpackinglight.com board and post that you think it's impossible to do a 4-day hike with a total load of 16.5 lbs. You'll find a ton of folks who do it with significantly less weight. My 16.5 lbs is barely at the fringes of UL backpacking.

Instead of calling me a liar, you might want to go do a little homework to find out what's possible and what other folks are doing. If you need a 90+L pack for backpacking 5-8 days, that's entirely your choice. Best of luck with it.
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post #20 of (permalink) Old 03-31-2015, 10:44 PM
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I just replaced my 90L pack with a 65, and the 65 is still very generous for trips over a week long. I'm nowhere near the ultralight category yet, but quite happy to have dropped below 20lbs before consumables and still prepared for all weather and night temperatures approaching freezing (haven't tested yet how far below freezing I can go), as well as carrying a roomy 2 man tent and cookware for 2.

If your pack is too big, it's too easy to bring extra stuff. Grams add up, other peoples' gear lists can help, but in the end it comes down to gathering gear and weighing it, and you'll be surprised with what you can achieve once you look at gear critically and start multi-purposing. Once you start dropping weight, you'll find you can get away with less volume too.

Back on topic, a hiking buddy of mine uses the Deuter (same size too I think) and is quite happy with it. Fit means a lot for a pack, so if it works for you, go for it. My pack is an osprey, and I've been quite happy with it so far.
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post #21 of (permalink) Old 03-31-2015, 11:31 PM
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Go for an 80L, 80lb pack. As someone on clubtread once said, "hauling gear builds character".
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post #22 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 12:56 AM
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Maybe your problem is that you have cheap, bulky crap. Plenty of people can do long trips with light gear and a small pack.
That is definitely not my problem. All my gear is lightweight, but I like comfort too. Plus my photo gear is usually around 10 lbs alone if not more. Sorry, I'm not going to haul my ass out there only to come back with cell phone photos.

Quote:
A good lightweight summer bag can pack down to 1L volume or less.
That's the size of a Nalgene water bottle. I don't know the warmth rating of such bag, but must be great for camping in h_ell.
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post #23 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 01:02 AM
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Yes Arnold, I carry a complete tent, including a footprint and stakes. Just because the fly alone resides in the front pocket of my pack doesn't mean I lied about carrying the rest of the tent. Did I really have to explain that?
Yes, you do have to explain that, because your weight just doesn't add up.

Quote:
Regarding food weight, you might want to look into getting yourself a dehydrator.
That still gonna get you a 4:1, maybe 5:1 calorie to gram ratio. So around 2250 calories a day. Unless you're a midget or hike for the entire 300 meters a day, you will starve. And forget about having any luxuries on your trip, like boiled eggs and hot dogs.

I can pretty safely assume the rest of your gear repertoire is similar in nature to your food - just barely enough to survive.

Quote:
Go over to the backpackinglight.com board and post that you think it's impossible to do a 4-day hike with a total load of 16.5 lbs. You'll find a ton of folks who do it with significantly less weight. My 16.5 lbs is barely at the fringes of UL backpacking.
I don't need to go over some crazies board, where they brag to each other how much they can torture themselves. In that case, I can hike in a t-shirt and shorts, with a water bottle in my hand. I will sleep under leaves and eat grass all day. Why not? Why would I carry 16.5 lbs on my back?

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If you need a 90+L pack for backpacking 5-8 days, that's entirely your choice. Best of luck with it.
Heck, I'll carry that bag for 1 night. As long as the bag is comfortable and supports the weight well, it's not an issue at all. I'll have enough warm clothes, eat well, and sleep in a roomy tent on a relatively thick mattress without shivering at night. Also, my toothbrush won't be cut in half in the morning.
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post #24 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 01:24 AM
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Good thread; informative taking two views and pros and cons when it comes to carrying weight vs comfort.

K
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post #25 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Arnold View Post
That's the size of a Nalgene water bottle. I don't know the warmth rating of such bag, but must be great for camping in h_ell.

My sleeping bag (rated to 4C) compresses down to just slightly larger than a Nalgene bottle and it isn't even down (which is more compressible).


Agree that that the camera gear will kill you. Went back and forth quite a bit over Christmas before deciding on an Olympus M5 with 2 pro lenses (micro 4:3 setup). Including the solar charger its about 4-5 pounds (weighs almost as much as my tent)
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post #26 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 12:48 PM
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Good thread; informative taking two views and pros and cons when it comes to carrying weight vs comfort.

K
I pack ultralight and camp in extreme comfort. I don't believe the two are mutually exclusive.
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post #27 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Arnold View Post
I would first check your scale to be accurate, because all of the above, including the pack, will not be at 16.5 lbs. And is it a tent or a tent fly? You need to be more honest about what's in your pack, because a tent fly is not a tent, while you listed a tent being packed.



And not everyone is willing to starve for 4 days on 1 lbs of food a day. That's less than most people eat while sitting on their ass at home all day.
Arnold, my 3 season list of all gear including the pack for the Rockies is just under 10 lbs. This includes clothing for comfort to -7C and a fully enclosed, bug proof shelter system. I also include a change of underwear.

No cuben fiber either.

I eat about 1.8 pounds per day in food, of which at least half is dehydrated, and this is the only variable (apart from water) that changes between trips.

I have never starved on a trip, nor have I been hypothermic.

So when you hear someone talk about base weight, they are referring only to the gear. Food and water are extra.

For a 5 day Rockies trip, I am at 19 pounds without water. Given the luxury of having a lot of water sources, I will only ever carry 1L. When I get to a water source, I will drink a full litre and pack another.

Edit: Regarding the sale, consider buying a digital one at Walmart for about $20. They are very accurate and you may be surprised at how much some things weigh as most manufacturer specifications are grossly inaccurate.

Last edited by FamilyGuy; 04-01-2015 at 01:01 PM. Reason: Added scale bit.
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post #28 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by El Tigre View Post
Hey everyone! I am pretty new here so bear with me if i'm beating a dead horse on this topic. I am getting into my first multi-day pack 5-8 day'r 70-80L. From my research, and it being my first pack, i dont see the need to spend more than 300$. I've narrowed my selections down to Deuter air contact 65+10 (because of the comfort and adjustability when I had it loaded in the store http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Backpa...tact-65-Plus10

and the MEC Serratus 85 (because of the 2 removable bags and generous sleeping bag compartment at the bottom. http://www.mec.ca/product/5034-395/m...10+50131+50597.

Im open to other suggestions and all feedback if anyone has used either of these packs.

Cheers!
Get the gear that you will carry in order first. Lighten that load (have a look at Andrew Skurka's book. While not the best on lightweight backpacking, it is a great starting point). Then take your gear to the store and see what size pack it will all fit into. Yes, you will look strange to others shopping. But you will also look hardcore.

Consider that if you bring a larger pack, you will be inclined to fill it. It happens. Trust me.

On a personal note, for 3 season a 50 litre pack works for me with an ultralight load. For winter, I would probably step up to a 60L because of the additional insulative layers required.
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post #29 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 01:06 PM
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Hahaha, this reads like the first two stages of grief:
- denial,
- anger
.... next is bargaining?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C3%BCbler-Ross_model



Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnold View Post
Yes, you do have to explain that, because your weight just doesn't add up.


That still gonna get you a 4:1, maybe 5:1 calorie to gram ratio. So around 2250 calories a day. Unless you're a midget or hike for the entire 300 meters a day, you will starve. And forget about having any luxuries on your trip, like boiled eggs and hot dogs.

I can pretty safely assume the rest of your gear repertoire is similar in nature to your food - just barely enough to survive.


I don't need to go over some crazies board, where they brag to each other how much they can torture themselves. In that case, I can hike in a t-shirt and shorts, with a water bottle in my hand. I will sleep under leaves and eat grass all day. Why not? Why would I carry 16.5 lbs on my back?


Heck, I'll carry that bag for 1 night. As long as the bag is comfortable and supports the weight well, it's not an issue at all. I'll have enough warm clothes, eat well, and sleep in a roomy tent on a relatively thick mattress without shivering at night. Also, my toothbrush won't be cut in half in the morning.
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post #30 of (permalink) Old 04-01-2015, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Arnold View Post
Sorry, I'm not going to haul my ass out there only to come back with cell phone photos.

That's the size of a Nalgene water bottle. I don't know the warmth rating of such bag, but must be great for camping in h_ell.
Why so angry?

First, get your buddies to carry the camera gear (just kidding). However, carrying 10lbs of camera gear does counter with the whole idea of lightweight backpacking so no one can help you there. My camera is 4 oz and takes great pictures. Admittedly, I am not much of a Photographer.

With respect to sleeping bags, thanks to 10d fabrics, differential cuts, and 850 plus down fill, we are now seeing sub 2 lb sleeping bags good to -10C (often EN rated - independently tested albeit not perfect but at least allows comparison between bags). If you go toward a quilt, you are looking at 1.5 lbs versions of this.

Do they require more care? Yes. No question.
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